Curse

Damian979 · Jun 19, 2008, 05:06 PM // 17:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damian979

I have 11 different builds based on the perma sf A/E. I use them for all aspects of PvE from elite mish's to primary's to farming, and they all use various skills that serve their purpose for where I'm at.

It's not just about the ectos. I was getting ectos before I ever made a sin. Though perma does mean I don't have to spend an hour just trying to get a group together just to go farm them.

Kanyatta · Jun 19, 2008, 05:19 PM // 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spangly_boy

Paragon

"Can't Touch This!": decreased Energy cost to 5.

It's about time. I called that buff back during the Nightfall Preview Weekend.

And why the nerf of Balthazar's Pendulum? That needed a buff, if anything.

_Todeshand_ · Jun 19, 2008, 05:41 PM // 17:41

Don't change SF please. Don't change the Chaos Plains run.

I love how the drop of ectos' value changed the economy. It's so much more fun now. More money/ectos in the game causes more people to want to buy things. So prices of certain Items go up. Many people lost a lot of money because of the changes of the ecto prices so they QQ. But actually the ectos' prices going down is a good thing for the economy. Don't stop it A.Net

Gun Pierson · Jun 19, 2008, 05:55 PM // 17:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by _Todeshand_

Don't change SF please. Don't change the Chaos Plains run.

I love how the drop of ectos' value changed the economy. It's so much more fun now. More money/ectos in the game causes more people to want to buy things. So prices of certain Items go up. Many people lost a lot of money because of the changes of the ecto prices so they QQ. But actually the ectos' prices going down is a good thing for the economy. Don't stop it A.Net

Yeah, let the ecto price drop to like 200g, just like amber chunks and jadeite shards. So all the perma sins would farm like 2K in a 30 minutes UW run lol. FOW armor lost its elite status a long time ago anyway.

Kalendraf · Jun 19, 2008, 07:17 PM // 19:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spangly_boy

Energy denial is not typically a good strategy in PvE,

...and they aren't willing to spend the time to try to make it so.

Which is unfortunate, because it wouldn't be all that hard to make them viable again. There used to be a PvE energy denial build that was a blast to play, but it got decimated by some early nerfs. All it takes is reverting a half-dozen key skills to their original versions, and it could work. Such a shame that ANet is too lazy to even bother with it.

Darksun · Jun 19, 2008, 07:45 PM // 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tramp

Anet has a bunch of monkeys with their ears and eyes covered. I guess the motto is: Hear no evil. See no evil. Change no evil.

Talk about being a monkey: I love how you left out the part where they EXPLAIN THE DAMN REASON THEY HAVEN'T MADE THE CHANGES:

Quote:

Some players feel it makes the game too easy while others think it is fun

Regardless of how much you or I hate Ursan there are enough people that enjoy it that they have a good reason to leave it.

Bryant Again · Jun 19, 2008, 08:10 PM // 20:10

Many people would "enjoy" being able to kill everything in one hit, as well. But it messes up more in the process.

Sir Pandra Pierva · Jun 19, 2008, 09:55 PM // 21:55

speaking of 1 it booms.

WHERES THE EOE REVERSION.

we all want it ANET. BRING IT BACK ALREADY.

and dont touch SF sin farming is actually kinda fun now. and its kinda nice to see sins get some respect in PVE

Cale Roughstar · Jun 19, 2008, 11:07 PM // 23:07

Well, these update notes are just going to make me stop sellin the ectos I farm with my sin

. If the price of them goes down, ill spend em on something, like FoW for my mules, and if it gets nerfed, well, I will have a bunch of ectos, which is always fun.

Age · Jun 19, 2008, 11:35 PM // 23:35

I would move glyth of swiftness to energy storage and require atleast 6 to 8 to be affective.

I am just glad all of you with A/E can farm as some of us can't as we don't have Sins and aren't going to buy an extra char slot just for this.

AOD_EaSyKiLL · Jun 19, 2008, 11:42 PM // 23:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

I would move glyth of swiftness to energy storage and require atleast 6 to 8 to be affective.

I am just glad all of you with A/E can farm as some of us can't as we don't have Sins and aren't going to buy an extra char slot just for this.

Your monk can farm much more stuff than a Sin, use it to farm.

Age · Jun 20, 2008, 05:47 AM // 05:47

Go and farm with my Monk where The Gates of Kryta,Bergon Hot Springs,The Marketplace or Arborstone.That is where all the bots except maybe the gates of Kryta and for what some unsellable stuff in todays market.I don't think so and most wouldn't buy it.I can't solo farm The UW like Sin can and make what they can.

There are others in this situation as well as not eveyone has a Sin.

Torabo · Jun 20, 2008, 09:37 AM // 09:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

I am just glad all of you with A/E can farm as some of us can't as we don't have Sins and aren't going to buy an extra char slot just for this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

Go and farm with my Monk where The Gates of Kryta,Bergon Hot Springs,The Marketplace or Arborstone.That is where all the bots except maybe the gates of Kryta and for what some unsellable stuff in todays market.I don't think so and most wouldn't buy it.I can't solo farm The UW like Sin can and make what they can.

There are others in this situation as well as not eveyone has a Sin.

Um... Whine much?
Where as other people's arguments had a little more merit... balance... economy... of debatable importance to each person, but there is merit... yours just seems to be 'you have what I don't have, I don't want to give up what I have (time/money/character slot/whatever) to get what you have. so you can't have it either'

Kinn · Jun 20, 2008, 12:23 PM // 12:23

Ok, first of all, I'd rather they didn't nerf SF - it has given me some fun builds to play with that have brought me back into the game after months of inactivity.

That said, I can see why the A/E farmer can be considered overpowered. The problem is that (as others have mentioned), once you make SF impossible to keep up, you end up with a skill that really isn't all that desirable to use at all in general PvE.

I think it's fair to say that if I am in a situation where I am left with no choice but to turn on some sort of invulnerability in order to survive a particular threat; then if that threat hasn't been completely subdued after my invulnerability runs out (leaving me with 10% health), I am going to be dead, more often than not.

At this precise moment, SF is the Assassin's uber-defensive skill. How do you balance an uber-defensive skill? Well, you could gimp the player's effectiveness of attacking, for one.

I'm not saying this is the solution to the Shadow Form problem, but consider this - rather than gimping the duration of SF, gimp the DPS of the player when in shadow form.

One way of doing it could be like this. Appended to the current SF skill description - "whilst under the effects of Shadow Form, all your non-Assassin attributes are reduced by 10...5 points each."

I pulled those numbers out of the air, but you get the idea. Maybe the attribute point reduction should be even harsher than that - maybe non-Assassin attributes could be set to 0 for the duration, I haven't really done the number-crunching. This would seriously reduce the DPS of the A/E nuker, but it would not kill the build entirely. It is still viable in general PvE, for tanking, pulling, running etc. etc. Gimping DPS would make farming slower, and rectify the imbalance.

JaiGaia · Jun 20, 2008, 01:04 PM // 13:04

NO nerf to SF ... no nerf to Ursan

For so long sins were near useless in so many PVe situations, ive been playing a sin for over two yrs i kn, its what caused me to quickly make my first three chars to the GW universe. SF now gives sins a new definition to the PVE aspect that helps balance them out a little more in diversity for different situations.

Right now ppl are only looking at the ecto factor but when one thing goes down something else will go up. As it seems the main problem with SF seems to be a particular area, so what? ... at one point and time u said the same thing about nerfing trappers down there, and urgoz too. Instead of nerfing the skill buff or change the area make it less accessible to the build. Similar to how u did the Urgoz or something.

TBH i hate Ursan its killed Pve in so many ways, infact i wont join Ursan groups, but its also not a bad thing as its helped make groups again which was needed for the community anyhow. As far as this OP skill its not really hurting anyone if the chunk of the community uses it then it also means that more ppl are on level ground as far as merchanting power as far as what this brings. Again if id propose u change the areas these are being overly used make them less accessible to the builds effectiveness rather than nerfing it. As though i hate the Ursan killing pve its effectiveness for clearing areas has made so the grind factor doesnt seem half as bad as it used to be.

Tyla · Jun 20, 2008, 01:07 PM // 13:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

I would move glyth of swiftness to energy storage and require atleast 6 to 8 to be affective.

I am just glad all of you with A/E can farm as some of us can't as we don't have Sins and aren't going to buy an extra char slot just for this.

[[arcane echo] would also be brainless to use.

Heck, I can successfully perma-SF on my Mesmer without any attribute enhancement in areas with alot of enemies, such as Raptors.

Just because people don't buy an extra character slot doesn't make this a candidate for nerfage.

Infact -- It's possible to farm UW as a Monk. I believe it's also possible to solo it without the need of anything else. Warriors can too, and so can the majority of the professions. Infact, Elementalists were already able to solo Chaos Plains before SF I believe.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaiGaia

For so long sins were near useless in so many PVe situations, ive been playing a sin for over two yrs i kn, its what caused me to quickly make my first three chars to the GW universe. SF now gives sins a new definition to the PVE aspect that helps balance them out a little more in diversity for different situations.

Wrong. Ever heard of Death Blossom?

The only diversity the new SF adds to an Assassin is... nothing! Perma-SF was already possible as long as you timed it correctly, and SF was possible for farming quickly already too. Apart from farming, SF will never touch my bar.

JaiGaia · Jun 20, 2008, 01:57 PM // 13:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Wrong. Ever heard of Death Blossom?

The only diversity the new SF adds to an Assassin is... nothing! Perma-SF was already possible as long as you timed it correctly, and SF was possible for farming quickly already too. Apart from farming, SF will never touch my bar.

yes i have, use it often... wasnt the point

and yes i kn it was already possible .. personally i dont kn why all the hype now as u stated theres so many builds capable of soloing different areas, personally this only affects ppl who were farming for cash in this spot before and now being outdone eventually it will even itself back out. My own personal opinion of this is stop complaining about skills being OP all the arguements can be debatable til we turn blue in the face, and unless theres real reason to bring about change than yes it should happen but if they nerf SF then Ursan should be nerfed to as thats been asked for longer and by more ppl than anything currently.

guevera verreuil · Jun 20, 2008, 02:05 PM // 14:05

*deep sigh*
*waves bye bye to pve completely*

Tyla · Jun 20, 2008, 02:07 PM // 14:07

I agree on Ursan being more of a nerf candidate than Shadow Form, as with all of the other PvE-only skills of super ultra awesome overpoweredness.

But the fact that SF was already usable and able to become permanent makes the fact that it doesn't add on to the "versatility" of a 'Sin.

FoxBat · Jun 20, 2008, 02:10 PM // 14:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

[[arcane echo]
Infact -- It's possible to farm UW as a Monk. I believe it's also possible to solo it without the need of anything else. Warriors can too, and so can the majority of the professions.

None of that matters really. Smites are sad and pathetic next to the Chaos Plains.

I am surprised everyone's gone crazy over the Sin though. Yeah perma-form was difficult before and now it's cake, but Eles can just glyph->obsidian, and have had the skills to do this farm for quite a while... why is everyone just waking up now?